Episode Transcript
Welcome to the Insync Insurance podcast. I'm your host Dawn Cross, and today we'll be discussing Nail Salon Safety with Rhian and Charlotte from Sunshine Training. If you enjoy our podcast, make sure to leave a rating on your favorite podcast director.
Brilliant. Well, thank you so much for coming back Rhian. It's lovely to see you again.
Yeah, thank you for inviting me back.
And also today we have got Charlotte with us.
Uh, now obviously we've got some background on Rhian. So Charlotte, could you give us a bit more background about how you came to be in a trainer role?
Of course. Yeah. Um, so I haven't always worked in this industry. I came into it quite late and, um, I was 41 when I started. So, um, I started with hair and then found a passion doing nails and beauty. And I've always been quite driven and wanted to, to do more all the time. So I decided to, um, share my knowledge and become an educator. Um, so I did that and passed my a in 2019, and that's where we started.
Oh, that's amazing. So is there anything that you prefer, like treatment wise? Is that Definitely just nails is like your, your niche.
Yeah. The nails is definitely my niche, a hundred percent. Um, but I do like, um, having the beauty side as well, so it just makes your day varied. So you're not doing the same thing day in and day out.
No. Yeah.
So our topic today is we wanted to talk more about kind of chemical usage in salons. Cause obviously, uh, a lot of people when they go through the training, they get taught how to be careful about chemicals, but I feel like maybe sometimes you need a refresher or even just to think about the longer lasting effects or even just down to, you know, if you've got an asthmatic staff member, for example, how we can best tackle it.
So my first question is, um, what are the most common chemicals used in beauty salons, especially within nail salons?
Yeah, so a lot of people actually don't realize it's actually nearly all the products we use in, in beauty salons have chemicals in them. Um, so in my salon we use a lot of nail products, obviously.
Um, and I suppose the most, the harshest chemicals are when I'm doing acrylics. Um, so monomer, I would say would be the most used that I have at work. Um, but obviously you've gotta remember that everything pretty much has an element of chemicals in, and a lot of people don't realize that. So, you know, down to like gel polish as well.
So, um, yeah, there's a, there's a lot that are generally widely used, but mostly mine is monomer that you use with acrylics. So, Following on from that kind of what safety precautions you would recommend that practitioner's employee, so this might be specially useful for anyone starting fresh out in the industry.
Yeah. So, um, when you're starting fresh out in the industry, um, everyone needs to make sure that they have risk assessments set up, um, in place, and that that goes from salons to anyone that works at home like myself, um, because, um, the chemicals have to be used and stored correctly. Um, so what I would say to them is get a risk assessment done.
Um, make sure that you follow in the manufacturer's guidelines for everything, um, down to how to use it, how to store it. Um, a lot of things because they've got chemicals in, have to be in dark, um, cool places. Um, and if we talk about things like the monomer, which I do use a lot, they have to be in non-flammable containers.
So everything that I have goes into metal cabinets in the salon. Um, so really they're the main areas I would say to look at and just follow, again, follow all the guidelines that come with those products that you're gonna be using. A hundred percent. Definitely.
Is there anything kind of customer wise as well that people need to look out for? Like, uh, is it worth people, for example, having, um, forms or like disclaimers, like, we're using these sort of chemicals, you know, just to make you aware before you book an appointment with us.
Yeah, absolutely. Um, obviously when a client gets in touch, they need to know the process of what they're actually booking, um, and not everybody does. Um, and they don't realize that there's chemicals involved in things. So, um, obviously if it's something that isn't nail related, it's, and it's a skin-based product, then obviously they're gonna need skin tests and things like that, and they'll have to sign. To say that they've actually had them done. And obviously we need to keep documentation of that as well that we can store.
So, yeah, absolutely. Um, having notes, um, and records of that is really important.
This is, it is normally done through consultation, isn't it?
Yeah, absolutely. So it can be done. Um, if it's something to do with beauty, it can be that they've turned up beforehand, and filled out the consultation forms because they're having a skin test.
Um, with nails, not so much we don't have to have skin tests, but we absolutely do, um, still need to make sure that, that we're being careful around that client with all these things that we are using. So, yeah.
And some chemicals can, um, cause like, um, contraindications and stuff like that, can't they?
So that's again why we tend to do more of the consultation with the client if they're first time, just to make sure that they're not gonna have any allergic reactions and stuff like that.
And yeah, so we need to know their history, their medical history, and make sure that, um, we're not using anything that they have had a reaction to in the past. Yeah. Okay.
No, I agree. And I think we've seen, uh, you know, not me personally, I'm not a practitioner, but we've seen certain instances and examples where, you know, clients maybe don't quite realize that maybe they'll have a repeat reaction and sometimes common sense goes out the window cause you're not, you know, feeling well. You're not, you don't make that link. So as a practitioner it's really good just to double and check with the history that, okay?
Yeah, no, maybe this isn't the best for you if you just told me this cuz some people don't quite realize, um, And this is also in reference to, we did an aesthetics episode with Agnes Kuziniak, and she was saying how someone had a reaction cause they didn't realize to tell the practitioner that they were actually on antibiotics at the time of the appointment.
But they didn't correlate that actually cuz they were on medications. They probably should have said something. So they just about avoided a reaction. But obviously the practitioner made sure to like double, triple check, which is always key.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. From like an education point of view as well, that we always say to all of our students, like when you are doing a consultation, you don't necessarily have to stick to that consultation as in the questions asked.
You can also go about and ask your own questions to really make sure that that treatment is right for that client at that time. Um, back when we all went back to normal just after Covid, we had quite a lot of, um, in the industry, quite a lot of different reactions coming about from hair colour and certain things.
Um, if people have had the covid jab, Um, so yeah, I mean, even I was one of those, um, I went and had a skin test done. I've never, ever reacted to anything in my life. Mm-hmm. Went and had, um, a skin test done for hair colour roughly around six months after having the first covid jab. And I reacted so severely to the colour.
Luckily it was only a patch test. Um, so that was a massive wake-up call for me. Um, and obviously being director of Sunshine Training, um, I then thought, well actually, there's quite a lot of people out there that dunno about this. So we've implemented all of this into all of our training manuals as well.
So any training courses that you do with Sunshine, you will learn about that as standard. Um, and as everything that Charlotte's already mentioned beforehand, um, we go a all over all of this anyway within all your training, our standards. So, um, yeah, it's just really important, really. Yeah, I agree. No, it's absolutely marvelous and as well that you've incorporated your own experience into almost like an extra safety standard.
You want everyone to start checking for it, especially with, you know, not everyone, not knowing how the full-term effects of the covid jabs, just because you know it's still fresh in you, the whole situation. You know, it's really good to kind of look at that because it has changed stuff in certain people's bodies or they've developed an allergy to a fruit as well or something.
Um, it caused, it's caused a lot more sensitivity. I've noticed aspiring clients, um, I dunno about you Charlotte, but I've noticed like with when you're doing training courses and stuff, and you've got models and stuff, you notice certain sensitivities on certain products. Um, and again, they might not. It might not be on the consultation form to ask someone if they've had a Covid job recently or something like that.
Cause they're not really talked about anymore. But it's super important for that client's health and safety that the practitioner knows about it. Yeah, absolutely. I agree. Um, and actually the, um, after Covid, the first part of Covid happened, and we all came out of lockdown; the government guidelines changed.
So they were actually, um, asking us to actually retest. Um, all of our clients that came through the door. Mm-hmm. It's like Rhian had said earlier, um, some people were reacting that had never reacted before because of the jabs that they've been having. So it's always, um, a good idea and obviously we should be retesting them after a certain amount of months anyway.
Yeah. Yeah, it's normally around six months or the manufacturer's guidelines, but also as another thing, um, again, a lot of practitioners don't know. They tend to go off manufacturer's instructions or just say like, six months, but also check with your insurance company because I know of insurance companies have got really hot on this recently, especially since Covid.
Um, and there's been quite a few different claims. Where, um, you know, the clients have come back or whatever and they haven't been correctly tested or they've not followed the guidelines when testing. They've not done it correctly, and then it's caused a bit of, um, trouble. So just always make sure that you are, um, checking your manufacturer's guidelines how to correctly do the patch test, and also check with your insurance company because they might be different to the, um, manufacturer's instructions.
No, that's definitely key. I wanted to follow up with a question, if I may. Um, so, so you were saying about how you imple, I implemented that, uh, new training aspect or in like your safety manuals. Um, could you gimme a little bit of insight of like other safety, um, bits that you do through your training courses to ensure that students are well prepared when starting to use products in the outside world?
Yeah, absolutely. So how Sunshine training is kind of structured. So every single course that you take through Sunshine Training, um, has four parts to each manual. So just a quick overview. Parts one and parts two are related to the treatment, and then parts three and parts four are generic, um, parts. So they follow.
So they have the exact same parts in every single manual. Um, and they are like what we were just talking about, um, following in manufacturers and guidelines. So parts three is all about, um, health and safety. I believe there's 13 different pages on, um, different legislation, um, sorry, different, um,
Yeah. Um, different kind of, um, health and safety sort of related, um, acts. So you've got data protection, you've got rid, you've got cash, all the relatable ones. And then we've got ones that Aren answer relatable that people don't necessarily talk about, but they're still equally important. Yeah. Um, and then part four is all the kind of laws and regulations.
That's where insurance really. Kicks in, um, and we have got quite a hef to write up about insurance and the different insurances you can get. So when our students take a course, they already kind of get the background knowledge on what they need insurance wise, because again, that's a massive subject, um, where student can just go hit a link.
And get insurance and they think they're insured for everything they've got. That's not necessarily true. You need to kind of have a background knowledge on what actually, um, insurance you need. So if you've got a salon, you need different insurance with your mobile and if you're salon based and stuff like that.
So, yeah, absolutely. Um, with regards to obviously your question, we, I'd say in total around the safety of products. Rules and regulations and that sort of thing over the two parts. You're looking about 30 pages worth of content just to kind of give you an idea of how hefty the information is. Um, and I am currently working on.
Um, adding more to it, but because they will be so hefty, me and Charlotte are gonna be, um, integrating them into removing them from the manuals and then integrating 'em as a its own course so people can actually go through it and they don't necessarily have to rush through it. Mm-hmm. They can actually learn more about it.
Um, cuz I do think that those parts are, although they can be deemed as boring, they are extremely important to our industry. So they're gonna be so in the next six months. Six to nine months, they'll be completely revamped and updated and loads more information will be on in there. I've already got the stuff I just need to put, implement it now.
No, that sounds brilliant because I think what some people don't get taught about, if, especially if they wanna go self-employed or with a salon, they probably think, oh, I don't have to think about those things too much. When actually they're very, very key to make sure you protect yourself as well as the people that you work with, uh, or your customers because you know, all the different acts and everything else have such an important part of things and of, unfortunately, if Saint did go wrong and he didn't, You know, protect your client's data.
For example, you, you are open unfortunately to some problems there, but that's brilliant how you just integrated it straight in there. And I think having a dedicated one is even better. Cause then, you know, anyone that's been in the industry but wants to brush up on making sure they know all the legal parts, I think would be beneficial.
Um, a hundred percent. Yeah. So that's part of why we were gonna do it as a thing. Um, but also, um, I think shorter term, if there are anyone listening and they, they've been in the industry a while and they actually think, actually I would like to brush up on all the different acts, then I will release a, um, kind of like an online course, which is all theory based and that'll go on an online platform.
Um, so yeah, I can give you more details on that dorm when it's available, and then we can. Let the listeners know when it's available and then they can Oh, definitely. You can leave it in the link, so at the time of listening as well. Hopefully they can click straight on it if they're in intrigued. Yeah, absolutely.
It's all about making the industry better and ensuring that the people that are qualified in the industry know what they need know, um, and not just the bare basics, because that's not gonna get you anywhere in the industry anymore. Um, especially as regulations and stuff are coming out is really important that you know exactly what you are doing.
Oh, definitely. So, um, circling back to Charlotte, I have one more question for you. Um, Are there any actions people can take to avoid, uh, triggering skim reactions or asthma, for example, that they could implement whilst, uh, they're working as a practitioner? Yeah, of course. So, um, as far as asthma goes, obviously we need to make sure that there's, um, good ventilation where we're working, um, whether that's a room, a salon, um, wherever it is that you are, um, wider spaces are better.
But if you can't obviously do that because you're working in a small room, then having good ventilation is, is key. Um, whether that means opening windows, using extraction systems, um, and also, you know, if you feel that still face masks can be used because obviously it's not just covid that we. Um, we, we've in initialized face masks because of that, but actually quite a lot of us have continued using them for different things.
Mm-hmm. Um, so if your client is somebody that's asthmatic, I do actually have some that are asthmatic or are prone to, um, infections, chest infections and things like that. So, you know, if there's any doubt your clients can actually wear face masks still as well. Um, and a lot of people don't realize that that's something we can continue on with.
Really, they just think of it. With Covid. Um, but yeah, certainly ventilation is definitely key with asthma. Um, as far as reactions going, obviously that stems back to what we were talking about before with the skin tests. Um, so obviously skin tests need to be done at least 48 hours before. Um, the client needs that time to make sure that their skin doesn't react to the products that we're using.
Um, and it's really important to make sure that everything. That you use? I mean, in, in my, um, salon, even down to, um, doing things, if there's an adhesive involved, everything goes on the skin. Um, and. Talking about reactions, I have got a couple of clients that have allergies. So, uh, one is not, and the other one's sesame seed.
So, um, although, um, the products that were, we were using on the treatments they were having were all natural ingredients. Ingredients. It was still something I tested on them. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So, um, you know, there was no chemicals involved at all. It was all natural facial products, but just to be sure that client signed a consultation card, they had a skin test and, um, I actually let them read the ingredients in the bottom of bottle as well, because I just think that was really important for them to just check for themselves.
Sometimes they need that for that peace of mind, so, so yeah, definitely, you know, Skin tests and ventilation is key for both of those. Um, and also over exposure. You've got to think about over exposure with products. Mm-hmm. Because somebody then may have that contra action as they go out the door, um, because somebody has been touching them with products that shouldn't have been touching the skin.
Mm-hmm. So, um, that is a big thing as well when you're doing a service, making sure there's no, no over exposure to you and your client. Definitely. Definitely and it's, um, it's good as well that you let them read it and everything else. Cause you know, for example, if you know you've done someone's nails and then a lot of, if not all practitioners probably will use some sort of cuticle oil or something just to kind of like meat and things up and help moisturize the skin area.
But like, you know, almond oil is a very well used sort. Source. But then obviously if they've got a nu allergy but they don't know that's what you've used, obviously you could then get skim reaction right at the end of treatment, which would be quite, yeah. And that is something that I do actually use Almond Doyle in my cubicle oil.
So yeah, you do have to be careful. Mm-hmm. So essentially just need to double check, uh, the customer to make sure that you know the products you can definitely use with them. And then obviously, You're less like to have a problem at the end of the day. And I think that's what everyone wants is someone to be happy after the service, go on the way, and then only get in contact when they want another service done instead of coming back with an issue.
Yeah, and I also, I also follow that with, um, the teaching side as well. So if students have models coming in, all the models have to have skin tests. And all the products. So they have to come into my salon before my teaching days come round, um, and have skin tests to be done. Um, and all, like I say, all the ADI is the products, everything, because obviously they're all under my care when they come in to have the training done with the student.
So it's really important that consultations are still done for that too. I love it. It's very thorough. And Yeah, and it kind of follows the student in the right path as well. If they, that's the, I suppose that's the whole point of, yeah. Central training in a way is that, Everything we do and the way the training's written is the way that we would work as a practitioner.
So, um, so if I was to do a client, it would be no different if I was teaching a student, if that makes sense. So everything I do, it's saying Charlotte, everything we do regards to consultation, what to look out for, skin analysis, all of that, that still gets taught in all of our lesson, in all of our courses because, It is really important, especially if someone's brand new to the industry and they've not had any, any form of background at all.
It's really important that they learn how to do things correctly, um, and properly, um, yeah, leading by example. At the end of the day, aren't we? Yeah, absolutely. Down to, yeah. Definitely. So, uh, as we are drawing to a close now, is there anything you guys would like to add after all that we spoke about on the episode?
Um, as far as I'm concerned, I think it's just, um, to follow, if it's somebody that's listening that is, Um, quite new to the industry or a qualified technician just to follow those manufacturer's guidelines with everything. Mm-hmm. Always do your skin tests, um, and look out for over exposure as well, cuz that is something that a lot of people don't think about.
Mm-hmm. Yeah, definitely. I mean, for me, um, the only thing I would say is I would hunch Centre with Charlotte. And if you're unsure how, if you're unsure of the manufacturer's guidelines, cuz not all products have them on there, then just contact that company. Um, and they should be able to give it to you, um, to let you know what their exact guidelines are.
And obviously, as I mentioned earlier in the episode, just make sure that you contact your insurance or find out from your insurance paperwork what they state. Um, because again, it. The manufacturer's guidelines might say patch test every six months, but then your insurance policy might say you have to do it every four months.
Um, so whichever is the soonest, follow that. Um, and just go with that really. And you can't go wrong. Um, obviously, as I said in the last episode, if anyone has any questions or wants to pick my brains for anything, then I'm more than happy for anyone new, old or um, qualified, whatever you can come. Contact me and I will do my best to help you.
Absolutely. That's Absolutely brilliant. Well, thank you so much for coming on today. No worries at all. Thank you. Thank you for inviting us.
Thank you to my guests today, Charlotte and Rhian for talking about Nail Salon on safety with us. If you're interested in learning more about Sunshine Training, please visit www.sunshinetraining.co.uk.
I have been your host Dawn Cross, tune next week for another episode. Insync is one of the UK's fastest growing insurance providers offering comprehensive cover for Esme and self-employed across the UK. Our expert team can tailor your insurance to meet your individual business needs and compare prices from our Lloyds of London-approved partners.
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